Turbo headers

[Speedy]

Stainless steel or mild steel and why is one better then the other? Looking to make around 800-850hp 1 5/8 or 1 3/4 primary? Thanks for your help and input.

Mike

[orangejuiced86]

x2 on the 1 5/8's.

[LT1Pat]

1-3/4 and I responded to your thread on yellowbullet

[Fryguy302]

1 5/8 IMO.

[Speedy]

search works real good...there are about 85 million stories and people opinions on which to use....
I have stainless, 1 5/8 will make that kind of power....


I was in a hurry and posted up. I'll try the search later. Thanks for the input everyone. Feel free to post up pictures of your set up and who's kit or builder did them.

[Speedy]

So what's the down fall to mild steel? I know stainless likes to crack and I'd think the mild steel would be more forgiving. Am I wrong?

[SS4Matt]

So what's the down fall to mild steel? I know stainless likes to crack and I'd think the mild steel would be more forgiving. Am I wrong?

i have 1 3/4" stainless for mine. i was told that mild steel can rust out or deteriorate on the inside and essentially it goes through your turbo which is not good....?

[Sean124]

How many Cubes what motor what turbo ?


Stainless steel or mild steel and why is one better then the other? Looking to make around 800-850hp 1 5/8 or 1 3/4 primary? Thanks for your help and input.

Mike

[P.F.M.]

I made fixtures off my HP kit. So the headers could be copied perty easy. If you are handy with a welder. Plus I made my own flanges all the way around. ;) SS would last almost forever but I you coated the MS then it would last for a while I would guess. As for size Hell I dont know.

[Anthony]

search works real good...there are about 85 million stories and people opinions on which to use....
I have stainless, 1 5/8 will make that kind of power....

wow, this guy MUST be from theturboforums.com :angel:

[Fryguy302]

Stainless will keep the rust flakes out of the turbine. Even coated in and out, you'd be surprised how fast mild steel will rust when it's used on the hot side. The first time you take it apart you'll see a bunch of rust in there.

I did some a bunch of research when we did mine, and 1 5/8 primary tubes and a 2.5" crossover seem to be the way to go. I know of 7 second cars with this combo.

Going to the turbo stuff was a little bit of a learning curve compared to the N/A and supercharged stuff I had before. I was a little surprised at how much stuff that was important before just doesn't matter when you run a turbo....and how much does matter that didn't before.

[Speedy]

I made fixtures off my HP kit. So the headers could be copied perty easy. If you are handy with a welder. Plus I made my own flanges all the way around. ;) SS would last almost forever but I you coated the MS then it would last for a while I would guess. As for size Hell I dont know.

Sweet a fixture! Yeah I here you can coat the M/S one with like a Swain tech coating but I'd have to look into that a bit more. I'll probly go S/S but not sure about size either.


Sean it'll be a 351 based motor. Trying to get a 408 off a buddy right now. As for turbo size think 70 or so.

[Speedy]

Stainless will keep the rust flakes out of the turbine. Even coated in and out, you'd be surprised how fast mild steel will rust when it's used on the hot side. The first time you take it apart you'll see a bunch of rust in there.

I did some a bunch of research when we did mine, and 1 5/8 primary tubes and a 2.5" crossover seem to be the way to go. I know of 7 second cars with this combo.

Going to the turbo stuff was a little bit of a learning curve compared to the N/A and supercharged stuff I had before. I was a little surprised at how much stuff that was important before just doesn't matter when you run a turbo....and how much does matter that didn't before.

So sounds like 1 5/8 will be more then enough for my goals. Thanks Raj!

[MystryGuy]

the mild will be more prone to droop under extreme heat and the stainless holds a little more heat energy in....

[Fryguy302]

Sweet a fixture! Yeah I here you can coat the M/S one with like a Swain tech coating but I'd have to look into that a bit more. I'll probly go S/S but not sure about size either.


Sean it'll be a 351 based motor. Trying to get a 408 off a buddy right now. As for turbo size think 70 or so.


Mike- If you're going to put a T70 or 76 on it, do not get a 408. Make the motor as small as possible. You'll want the block strength of a windsor if you're not using a race block, so I'd go no bigger than 357cid. The smaller turbos like that will work better with a smaller motor.

[team_southside]

Mike- If you're going to put a T70 or 76 on it, do not get a 408. Make the motor as small as possible. You'll want the block strength of a windsor if you're not using a race block, so I'd go no bigger than 357cid. The smaller turbos like that will work better with a smaller motor.

x2

[Pwraddr]

X3...Mike I didn't know you were going turbo?

[Speedy]

Mike- If you're going to put a T70 or 76 on it, do not get a 408. Make the motor as small as possible. You'll want the block strength of a windsor if you're not using a race block, so I'd go no bigger than 357cid. The smaller turbos like that will work better with a smaller motor.

Dang that throws a wrench in my plans





X3...Mike I didn't know you were going turbo?

:D All out on this build lol. Figured these is my last chance at building a bad ass car so go big.



Thanks for all the info everyone! +1's going around :)

[Fryguy302]

Dang that throws a wrench in my plans




Nothin' wrong with the 408, just use a big turbo instead :)

[Sean124]

70mm would be a bit smallish for a 351 and way to small for a 408. If you go with a 351 run 1 5/8 is you plan to stay under 6500 rpm if you go with a 408 I would run 1 3/4 if you stay under 6500.

For a 351 under 6500 I would go with a out of the box s400 preferably with a 1.10 hotside and 87mm wheel.

For a 408 I would go 1.36 hotside same wheel or the 96mm wheel. the larger 96mm will spool a bit slower. I would also sugest the 80mm upgrade comrpessor for use upto 6500rpm on a s400 and a 408.

Stainless all the way. Mildsteel has problems with carbon creeping. The tube wil not rust as much as it will just crack off one flake at a time. The ultimate material for turbo headers is inconel. 304 stainless at a minimum and 316L is prefered or 321L is the best then inconel.


Sweet a fixture! Yeah I here you can coat the M/S one with like a Swain tech coating but I'd have to look into that a bit more. I'll probly go S/S but not sure about size either.


Sean it'll be a 351 based motor. Trying to get a 408 off a buddy right now. As for turbo size think 70 or so.

[P.F.M.]

Pfffttt and have you ever worked with inconel??? Holt shit what a nightmare to machine.(but it can be done if you know what you are doing ;) ) I could not imagine building a turbo kit from it. Especially out of a home garage.

[igotaneed4speed]

Pfffttt and have you ever worked with inconel??? Holt shit what a nightmare to machine.(but it can be done if you know what you are doing ;) ) I could not imagine building a turbo kit from it. Especially out of a home garage.


That shits insanly expensive. Stainless would be just fine, M/S works but alot of people dont like it cuz of the chance of rust and flaking like Raj mentioned.

I've used ms on a few of mine and in the end by the time you coat them and what not., everything stainless comes out couple bucks more and will last longer in long run.

Velocity and heat retention pre-turbine is what you want, 1 5/8" would be fine for somthing around 400" and under in the 7k range like Sean said. I ran 1 5/8 and 2 1/2 cross over on my old set-up with a S400. Switch to 1 3/4 and 3" cross over and pick up a lil with no change in lag. This was a big inch SBF though

[Speedy]

Thanks guys I have a lot of stuff to learn on this. Any good sites? Anyone want to post up pictures of their set ups?

[Speedy]

As someone else already gave me a hard time about, check out www.turbomustangs.com/smf

Its another forum, but has tons of info in a centralized location. Whats your email? I can send you pic's from tons of cars, and help out maybe with any info I can too...
Something else to do would be to go to each kit manufacturer's site and check out their layouts...Make a plan for what you want to do based on what you see and how you are going to make the parts, and what you ideally want in the end.
HP, Hellion, Turbo Technology, B&G, are just a few I can think of now...

Be prepared/warned, its a big pain in the ass, tedious and time consuming to do, did I mention expensive too?

Thanks! speedy@wowway.com and I hear you on the time and $

[Speedy]

70mm would be a bit smallish for a 351 and way to small for a 408. If you go with a 351 run 1 5/8 is you plan to stay under 6500 rpm if you go with a 408 I would run 1 3/4 if you stay under 6500.

For a 351 under 6500 I would go with a out of the box s400 preferably with a 1.10 hotside and 87mm wheel.

For a 408 I would go 1.36 hotside same wheel or the 96mm wheel. the larger 96mm will spool a bit slower. I would also sugest the 80mm upgrade comrpessor for use upto 6500rpm on a s400 and a 408.



Damn that turbo is big! But the price is great http://www.dallasturbo.com/specials1.html

[P.F.M.]

http://motownmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67849

This turbo might work if you are piecing a kit together. Raj could tell ya if it would work with what you are thinking about doing. I think Dan still has it forsale. It might not be big enough if you do the 408.

My car
http://www.turbochargedpower.com/Moody%2092%20LX.htm

Some really good stuff here too.
http://saleen.v8mustang.com/

Plus my turd is just down the street if you want to see it.

[Anthony]

that turbo sold

[Sean124]

Let me know if you want something.


Damn that turbo is big! But the price is great http://www.dallasturbo.com/specials1.html

[Speedy]

http://motownmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67849

This turbo might work if you are piecing a kit together. Raj could tell ya if it would work with what you are thinking about doing. I think Dan still has it forsale. It might not be big enough if you do the 408.

My car
http://www.turbochargedpower.com/Moody%2092%20LX.htm

Some really good stuff here too.
http://saleen.v8mustang.com/

Plus my turd is just down the street if you want to see it.

Car looks good Paul! Thanks for the info. I didn't know you lived in Sterling Hts. Yeah I'd like to check it out one day

[Speedy]

Let me know if you want something.



As soon as I have a solid game plan and sell one of the other cars. I only have nickle and dime money right now

[P.F.M.]

Thanks It more than I ever thought I would have. Plus there is alot left in it.Nope not at BA's but I'm only a couple of miles away. ;)

[Sean124]

I know of someone selling a S400 Race cover Borgwarner turbo 80mm Compressor upgrade and it has the larger 1.36 A/R turbine with the 96mm wheel. Would work great on a big 408. Lots of airflow and plenty of upstairs power. If you decide you want it let me know.

Sean


As soon as I have a solid game plan and sell one of the other cars. I only have nickle and dime money right now

[SS4Matt]

you can find pictures of my build on the first page here. nothing much has changed since those pictures as i'm at the point of the "finishing BS" but you can get an idea of what sean and greg did on my car with 1 3/4" stainless headers, 2 1/2" stainless crossover and a 4" stainless downpipe all the way back. my motor is only ~346" and i have an 80mm turbo
http://motownmuscle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67073

[Sean124]

I have been improving my Stainless welding skills since those headers were built. Finally figured out how to get the rainbow to consistenly appear on the weld now.

[Draco]

I have been improving my Stainless welding skills since those headers were built. Finally figured out how to get the rainbow to consistenly appear on the weld now.

have you used solar flux on the inside of your tubes when welding stainless? if not, you should look at it. your welds will look gold, this helps alot and you no longer need to purge the inside of the pipe...you will also need methanol to mix with the solar flux its like a paste that you make then spread on the pipe before you weld

[Sean124]

Can you PM me the detials on this ?


have you used solar flux on the inside of your tubes when welding stainless? if not, you should look at it. your welds will look gold, this helps alot and you no longer need to purge the inside of the pipe...you will also need methanol to mix with the solar flux its like a paste that you make then spread on the pipe before you weld

[Draco]

PM sent

[Sean124]

Thanx a bunch.

PM sent

[Speedy]

I know of someone selling a S400 Race cover Borgwarner turbo 80mm Compressor upgrade and it has the larger 1.36 A/R turbine with the 96mm wheel. Would work great on a big 408. Lots of airflow and plenty of upstairs power. If you decide you want it let me know.

Sean

I'll let you know as soon as I hear word on the 408. Thanks

[Built2lead]

damn thats gonna be alot of power

[SSnthe10s]

I just cought this thread. We made our turbo headers out of 304ss. Stainless in the long run will hold up to the heat better. Here are a couple pix of the headers. Going on a TT 406 SBC.

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/Mikej650/217008352LdJatX_ph.jpg
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d33/Mikej650/217356129ZYTpUF_ph.jpg

[Speedy]

Nice job!

[SSnthe10s]

Thanks! Thinking about making some merge collectors for it at work. The stamped collector just dont look as nice. But they would prolly make nearly the same Power.

[LT1Pat]

Try these? http://www.coneeng.com/exhaust_system_kits.html

Thanks! Thinking about making some merge collectors for it at work. The stamped collector just dont look as nice. But they would prolly make nearly the same Power.

[SSnthe10s]

Try these? http://www.coneeng.com/exhaust_system_kits.html

thanks will looking in to them!